The Terminator Files Forum

The real TERMINATOR saga : Terminator & Terminator 2

T-3 and the other, (and let's say, the SC Chronicles) have nothing to do with the real deal. For me, those are completely different stuff and neither of them can be counted as one of the originals.

And why these aren't belong to the real deal ?

- The absence of the original music
- Female Terminators and all that bullsh*t
- John's never into lovey dovey stuff... A female Terminator ? Chasing girls ? Falling in love ? COME ON... And John having kids ??? LOL
- Silly and completely unfunny humor (so called humor)..
- Sarah Connor's personality and behavior... (<-- She can only be played by Linda Hamilton)
- Usually the camera angles and the scenes...
- And all the concept, the air...

There are a lot other things, but these will be enough i reckon.

So,

Do you agree or not ? If you call yourself a true T-worshipper, then YOU HAVE TO AGREE WITH ME or don't fool yourself.

I disagree... and I still call myself a true T-worshipper.

We might have our differences, the many members of the Terminator(files) community... but we agree to disagree.

To blatently call anyone else a non Terminator fan just cause they do not follow your own ideal world... is a bit far fetched. Nice first post.

It's like dealing with the mob. "Feel free to disagree, but if you do, I'll kill you."

Well see ther are so many other outlets to the world of James Cameron.

Saying that T1 and T2 are the only ones to live by, you have to include the novels because they give you insight on things that are not said, or can't be explained properly in a 2 hour film. That being said, we would never know what a T-800 is. Only a CyberDyne Systems Model One-Zero-One. And if you're only accepting the movies, you can't accept their scripts because things are said or acted differently, or staged in other areas than even the final shooting script.

We could go thru and list all the dozens and dozens of different timelines the comic books, novels, video games, tv show, unmade cartoon, graphic novels, even certain events in the other two movies, create (that's even including the fanmade fictions) but you can always find a some of them on the home page.

After Salvation and reading a lot of the other novels, like those by Randall Frakes, Timothy Zahn, S.M. Stirling, and the Dark Horse Comics, the Dynamite comics, I've been to accept bits and pieces of information, machine designs, Resistance ideas and slang, as part of the whole of James Cameron's vision of the world after Judgement Day. Even a lot fo the concept art can be accepted because, Skynet is, will, has, and could try many of the designs out there that were unproduced. The Centurion Hunter Killer is an excellent example. The T-600 is another. The Aerial HK "Shark" Fighter from the Sarah Connor Chronicles is one more.

With so much out there, we can certainly pool those resources together and create a somewhat solid timeline. However, they are nto all set up like that, T3 would not occur with T2's temporal jumps, Salvation would not have occured without the T'X's interference a la Kate is present and more modern weapons and technology are available.

It all comes down to what makes sense, and what would be fun to discuss about. And our community of fans have so many varying opinions and ideas that it only helps build and strengthen the franchise and the continuing interest and fan base for...THE TERMINATOR!

Crimson makes a good point and so does Vic. You have to take all the other material into consideration, but just judging from the publicly released media alone, T3, TS and TSCC opens our minds to what else could have/might/possibly happen in the terminator universe that wasn't envisioned in the first two movies. Much of our judgment of the recent terminator movies 1) is shaded by the fact there are so many sequels, prequels, remakes, reboots, reimaginings that we are more interested in original ideas, 2) that anything made after the original will never be as good so we are already biased to begin with, 3) but most importantly that James Cameron has never had anything to do with terminator since T2:3D.

It's agreed that 99.9% of us here will almost always favor the first two movies over the last two and TSCC, but we still get excited when some new terminator thing is announced. Of course more doesn't necessarily mean better.

Sometimes I like to think of T3, TS, and TSCC as more of a thrill ride meant to entertain for the sole purpose of well, entertaining, sort of like T2:3D. I don't boggle my mind over it and analyze them as I would with the first two movies, but going as far as saying anything after the first two movies is complete and utter sh!t and therefore constitutes a fake/false Terminator worshipper is a bit much.

I don't agree. T1 and T2 are the only good movies of the series. However I consider the other 2 movies also part of the series, they are Terminator movies (somehow).

I can agree with the OP to a point, at least to the extent that nothing done since T2 has managed to measure up against the first two films. I do consider TSCC to be canon to the time line established by those films (T3/T4 are dead to me), and while I'm sure there are many who don't agree with that I don't think it makes me any less of a true fan.

Anyway, to address some of your points:


Agree. I didn't care for the musical score of either of the last two movies or the TV series.


Disagree. What's wrong with female terminators? Why wouldn't SkyNet develop female terminators? Do they all have to be hulking macho men?


Disagree. Again, why wouldn't John be chasing girls? Why wouldn't he eventually pursue a relationship with someone? Why wouldn't he have kids? He's not a eunuch.


Agreed.


Disagree. Obviously you must be referring to the character as portrayed on the TV series. Linda Hamilton did a great job in T2 of being the hardened warrior type hell-bent on preventing the apocalypse, but I think Lena Heady did a fantastic job of being the hardened warrior type hell-bent on preventing the apocalypse...and also being a mother to her teenage son.


Don't know what you mean by this.


What?


Definitely disagree.

I'll just agree with what HopeOftheFuture says in regards to that. The first two films were clearly the best of the series, no doubt. I don't think there's a single person here that will argue that point. But to suggest that anyone who enjoyed T3/T4/TSCC is fooling themselves and doesn't constitute a true fan is really a pretty ignorant statement, tbh.

To each his own in regards to which films you choose to enjoy. I think a true terminator fan is someone who enjoys any continuation of the franchise, even if it's not perfect.

For me the Judgment Day is stopped and the coda ending is the one and only ending to the story. Not because the next 2 movies were so bad, but because its a perfectly done, finished and complete story (T1 and T2)

I hate the idea of Connor having wife and kids. Did you see Sarah Connor starting a family? Not even in the Coda ending. Do you remember Reese talking about their relationships in the future? No? Cause there weren't any. There was no time for bullshit and Connor was a solitary man devoted fully to the cause like his mother, father and all the other soldiers.

Can you imagine Rambo with wife and kids? Or Quaritch? No, and thats cause he had his mind set only on goal. Just like Sarah. And even for Reese all else was secondary. Reese, such great and good looking soldier NEVER had a girl even. Yet there are plenty of women there, "good fighters". And here they give Connor a family..

And who would bring kids to such cruel world ridden with pain, hunger and filth? Only to have more future soldiers, but definitely not for family purposes. And how can he afford to have a family that can be both a target for SKynet and now Connor has someones life on his hands, he cant just dye cause what about the kids he brought into this world?



But heres the thing. Female covering is perfectly fine. Its that the endo is female that's really dumb. Even one of the writers had seen the stupidity of it, but the stidio forced them to have one. John Brancato: the bad terminator had to be a female (robots have genders?)

Valid points, but then again we're not talking about John Connor from 2029.

Just for the sake of argument, lets discard the coda ending for a minute. It wasn't in the theatrical release so let's just pretend it didn't happen for a second. Now, the story ends with John destroying the endo arm, the chip, and Uncle Bob, and now JD is thwarted and all is right with the world. John and Sarah get to live out there happy lives in peace doing what happy people do knowing that the end of the world as been averted. So... where do we go from here?

Wouldn't they go on to attempt to lead some semblance of a normal life? Wouldn't that involve (at least for John) going to school, making friends, meeting chicks, getting married, having babies? Or is he really expected to just go on being some weird loner obsessing over the need to fulfill his destiny that is no longer to be?

Reese obviously didn't pursue any intimate relationships because he grew up in an environment of war, sickness and death. John Connor didn't. John Connor (as far as he knew at the end of T2) prevented all that from happening.

So again, why wouldn't he and Sarah seek to lead a normal life at that point?


True enough, but I think it's excusable. Are we really to believe that SkyNet would try to fit a female skin sheath over an 800 series endoskeleton? Adaptations would have to be made.

The TX did suck though.

Only because arguing is pointless, not because everyone agrees.

Welp, that's why I says to each his own.

Not gonna judge anyone who prefers one film over another just because I don't feel the same.

Yeah, why not? According to Rosengrant, different models of T-800 would have different sizes and skull shapes. So smaller endos could definitely have a female covering



Disagree. Even tho TX's endo was shaped like a female model, it still imitated male Scott without any problems. Im sure it could work the other way too

Me? I'm just easily entertained. I've loved each terminator film, and loved the two seasons of the Sarah Connor tv show. Have read all the comics, and am now reading thru all the novels, and am enjoying it all. But I love what I want and don't let anyone else change my views of things. Nor do I try to change others views either. Life is too short...and I'm halfway thru it... that is if I can make it to 88 years of age!!! hehe

For me T1 and T2 are the only two parts of the Terminator saga that I'm interested in watching. T3 is an abomination, TS is average enough sci-fi action movie, but never truly feels like the Terminator sequel/prequel that we should have got. As for T:SCC, truth is I'm a big fan of genre television, in particularly serialised genre television and I think the series had a lot going for it and for the most part feels more like a continuation of Cameron's work. It has a melancholic feel and moments of touching emotion and humour that feels more Terminator-esque and does a better job of continuing the Terminator sage post T2 than T3 did. I wouldn't say it was a complete success, the 22 part second season seemed to have more issues than the much shorted 9 episode first run, but I think the writers and producers did a better job than the writers and directors of Rise of the Machines attempted.